Font size test, part 2. Download the fonts, alpha 0.1: https://www.davidrevoy.com/data/documents/2024-04-20_DeevadHand_alpha1.zip (265KB, Open Font License)
@davidrevoy need to squint a lil bit but could read the bubbles fine (except the one that mumble the size font)
@davidrevoy@framapiaf.org Deevadhand is more in that sweetspot, nice and clear. Readable for me.
They both seem equally readable to me.
@davidrevoy If you ever feel bored, there are more pangrams:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pangram
I like the Sphinx one
@andre Great! I bookmarked it. Perfect to copy paste in Font Forge in the metric simulator to spot more error.
And "The five boxing wizards jump quickly." feels already like a MiniFantasyTheater episode
@davidrevoy I feel the letter spacing could receive some more love.
The BROWN felt quite squished to me.
@davidrevoy Do you have number literals?
Especially 0 and O (zero and uppercase o) can be hard to tell apart.
It appears that you dropped the lowercase characters so no confusion of I and l (uppercase i, lowercase L).
@andre hey, yes, the font has numerals and I customized them already. I put the font in Small Caps situation for easy copy pasting my lines of dialog from my scenario (markdown) and get this type of rendering. I'll try probably to customise a bit the capitals later.
@andre True for the spacing of the Bold variant.
@davidrevoy I like the font, it is easy readable even in 14px. I guess 12px would be fine too if my eyes were younger.
Just a thought about "ALL CAPS" text in comics. Maybe you know that in German grammar, some words must be capitalized mid-sentence. When I was a child, I was a very big fan of Tintin and Snowy. I learned reading rather early thanks to Hergé's famous comics, and also got a good feeling about German grammar. Todays German editions of Tintin have changed to ALL CAPS now. I think it's sad because if I were learning to read with Tintin today, I would have been unable to learn the correct capitalization of words. IMHO it would be great to keep using caps and small letters, like you do in Pepper & Carrot. Just my two cents.
@shred Thank you! This font is supposed to be a Small Caps one ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_caps ) and I already differentiated for example the I of the i. So, with a bit more work, I can probably makes the capital a little bit taller, so the start of sentence works better and it might fix the situation in German. Thank you for this feedback, it give me a wider view of possible future problems that might be easier to solve now .
@davidrevoy The bold is much bolder and is actually visibly different, and the É et al I find clearer in Deevahand. Nice!
@maswan Thank you! Yes, I changed all the font to be a Small Caps one, so I can copy/paste the line of my scenario and it should render well. I could differentiate the I of the i this way. I'll probably makes some real capital a bit more interesting for when I start a sentence.
About the bold, yes! I really like when the emphasis is strong. It makes sens in a comic as it is often just a word or two that are bold this way.
@davidrevoy Steinig this font in use and comparing it to the last one (Kalam), I can read Kalam better. IMHO there are too many straight vertical lines in Deevadhand (and it is too narrow). Perhaps it is more readable when in cursive and a little bit more space between the characters.
@AxelStieglbauer Hey, I had same feeling with Kalam (that's why I put it in the demo speechbubble, and it had a green checker next to it) but also, I have some troubles (slight dyslexia, dysgraphia too) and what is readable for me is often not something agreed universally.
But sure, a bit more spacing on DeevadHand could help. I dislike when the letter are also touching each other. With JPG compression and downscaling, it feels like a soup sometime.
@davidrevoy
To put the fonts in a "real life test", could you make one of your Pepper&Carrot comics in a Kalam and in a DeevadHand version?
Results of tests in the lab (in the showcase boxes below the one-frame-comic) may not transfer well to the intended use cases.
@davidrevoy Je retravaillerais le M : sur la petite bulle, je vois HUMBLE ou HUHBLE suivant comment mon œil cligne. Et d’accord avec les commentaires disant d’espacer un peu plus verticalement (et un peu plus peut-être certains passages en gras, par exemple sur VA c’est ok mais pas sur OU et OW).
@amic Merci pour le retour Amic!
Oui, le M a sans doute besoin d'un peu plus de cassant. Une fois réduit avec la compression JPG et le flou que ça provoque, c'est vrai qu'il est difficile a discerner d'un H.
@1or11 Thanks for the screenshots and feedback: very interesting to see how a part of the sentence is crop. That will help me to put guides in my template as a safespace around the picture, where to not put important info and text.
@davidrevoy it’s actually quite legible at all the sizes on my phone! Good font.
@davidrevoy saw it in the feed reader and then checked this post in Tusky. I like it and it's really good readable in all sizes - only the 12px font suffers from the slight blur in the preview in Tusky. But then - comparing blurred and resized images with what you intended is not the goal here.
@elvith Thank you, yes the 12px is really dangerous area. I'll not use it. 14px, maybe for small joke or private joke; rarely. Or when acharacter speaks really low volume or mumble.
@davidrevoy Huah, that was quick work. I like this font; it's looking clean! (screenshot specs: OP8T, using Moshidon)
@JadedNorthman Thank you! Oh yes, I put a big block of 10h on it. Font is a bit endless work, I'll probably continue on the fly while producing the episode. So many little things I want to improve.
Thank you for the screenshot, it helps to see what's going on.
@davidrevoy super awesome font!!
@davidrevoy
Nice. Your Z is way better than the original!
Love the touch of the dot on the I, even if it's uppercase: I can control my grammar nazi OCD.
@AAMfP Thank you! I plan to differentiate (slightly) the capital letter, right now the I/i are different, because it works better this way with English for the start of the sentence. on a grammar POV, it should be correct for a Small Caps font.
@davidrevoy take also a look at Atkison Hyperlegible here https://brailleinstitute.org/freefont
Unfortunately license is not free but it's free for use _unless_ you sell the font.
Anyway, might be interesting to look at.
Or, the whole set of GNU FreeFont at https://www.gnu.org/software/freefont/ even id it's bit pretty standard and not so fancy.
@davidrevoy Happy to report that it also works pretty well in akkoma/pleroma with it’s downscaling to fit inside a 16:9 box. 14px is where readability stops for me.
And thanks for making the font file available
@slatian Nice! thanks for the feedback (and cool color for the links and hashtag!)
@davidrevoy Both are pretty readable, but I'd like to note that the curving on the middle of the M for "Deevadhand" in the 14px example was almost completely lost for me on a 1440p monitor so I read that curve as a straight line so I read "Humble" for a moment before correcting from context. Very small thing, but worth noting that you could emphasize that just slightly more so there is more "curve" section to the hump.
I also find the "Deevadhand" italics seem to render a little funny, like a "faux italic" for a font that lacks it. I'm not if that's actually the case here.
Just some thoughts, cool that you're doing all this work!
@john Thank you for the feedback! Yes, the M is more problematic than what I thought, especially at this size. Thanks for mentioning it, it will be a high priority to fix it.
The Italic variant is a font, but this one is just using some transform filter, and I probably put too much angle in it. A fun fact, the Bold and Italic of Patrick Hand is actually faux bold and italic, generated by Qt probably in Krita text tool. So, the faux italic of PatrickHand is actually better than my italic.
@davidrevoy Lol, faux italic/bolds can be super convincing in these programs!
Yeah I think the angle was a little overkill that did it in
If you (somehow) had the time to make an italic it would be greatly appreciated, I haven't read P&C in a while, but I know italics and bolds can add a lot to speech bubbles (makes it feel more like someone's speaking)
Thanks for the reply by the way you're a super cool guy David, mad respect!
@Sivar Hey, thank you. The previous post was testing 3 different fonts. The first one got the most feedback (Patrick Hand) but also I had things I wanted to fix in it. This is another step; improving the font. Customization is also something I wanted to get a special look closer of what I have in mind.
@davidrevoy they both look great. Either is very readable for me!
@davidrevoy just asked my dyslexic girlfriend and she prefers the top one! Both are still readable though
@davidrevoy I'm sure you intended it as your personal quirk, but the first thing that came to mind when seeing the dotted uppercase I was "this is not going to work for Turkish" (actually I thought "this might drive Turkish readers mad!", but I'm not Turkish so I don't know if it's actually the case).
@davidrevoy I think I like the original a bit better because it is less horizontally symmetrical: the original D is bottom-heavy and the O is top-heavy, and that helps making them more distinct, and the overall font less monotone. (That's probably that font's personal quirk, since the more obvious thing would be the opposite: to make D top-heavy and O bottom-heavy like an egg).
Aesthetically, I do prefer the non-crossed Z, for sure!
@hisham_hm Thanks for the feedback. Oh sure for the internationalization, it will require a lot of work. I'll figure it incrementally as I did for the Lavi font of Pepper&Carrot. About the variation of shapes, that's a good point. I'll continue to edit and keep this in mind, thanks!
@davidrevoy Hi David, I love the font, could a regular (lowercase) typeset be made, as it looks weird with all capitals except “i”s in the middle of words, it doesn’t look right.
Love the work!
@orbitalmartian Hey, lowercase character are part of the design of PatrickHand by default ( src: https://fonts.google.com/specimen/Patrick+Hand?classification=Handwriting ) , for the DeevadHand I'm looking after a Small Caps ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_caps ) type of font for comics closer to what I would do if I have handwritten them. I had feedback who praised this I/i differentiation, so it's a bit a 'taste' situation. My handwritten test had them differentiated so I'll probably keep that. Maybe I'll differentiate all caps a bit more.
@davidrevoy I mean I love the aesthetic of the font (and the all caps with the little i’s it shows its an i and not an L). My only other thing is actually capital letters (like the start of a sentence, or a noun) aren’t any different to smallcaps. But I know it’s still being worked on so good luck with the future work on it :)
@orbitalmartian Thank you, oh yes, I want to improve the capitals to get their tiny "something", not sure they'll be much taller or bolder, but maybe 10% with their own style would be the dream
@davidrevoy bold font is definitely more noticeable but it slightly too close and blends. Maybe a little more distance between bold letters would be nice.
@mykolak Right, thank you. Yes, more spacing for the bold letters makes sens.
@davidrevoy I could read each message easily.
@davidrevoy 14 and 12 pt are still readable on my thumbnail. Not easily, but I can read them. I think that I like the changes to the glyphs you've made. Though I'm not sure about the i, as it kind of feels out of place? I get why it's done that way.
@davidrevoy The M may need a bit more tweaking to make it look less like an H! That said I like deevadhand a lot.
@davidrevoy It's gorgeous
@davidrevoy I like it, thanks for sharing. I have a bit the feeling that V, W, X, Y and Z are a bit too much falling to the right (slanted) compared to the rest of the alphabet. But maybe it works well in normal words?